Michele Skalicky talks with Allison Aubrey, health and science correspondent for NPR, about her new book, "Your Turn: How to Create a Midlife you Love."
Skalicky: So, Allison, why did you decide to take a sabbatical — what you call a gap year — to explore what midlife and beyond might have to offer?
Aubrey: Well, I think it's a strategy that I followed because in many ways it was replicating the formula I have here in my reporting. You know, you have a question. How do you answer it? You go out into the world and find examples of people who have done the thing you're looking for. In my case, I had a very simple question: What would life be like beyond parenting, beyond the paycheck? I've been in what I call the sort of moon bounce of controlled chaos, jumping between parenting duties and deadlines for 25 years now. And I was a bit worried, like were my best years behind me? Like what happens when you leave the newsroom? A place that has been the center of my life for many years and obviously an exciting place to be. And I thought, wow, is there — what is it like on the other side? So, the sabbatical or the curiosity tour or the gap year was really, you know, my questioning of what does it look like? Who are the women like me? You know, I didn't want to hear about movie stars or billionaires or super influencers making midlife pivots. I wanted to know, where were the women like me who've been in the trenches? How are they making midlife pivots and what does that look like and what's the formula? So, that's really what the book became.
Skalicky: I love that you're sharing stories of everyday women because that's who the general public can relate to. So, who is this book for? I mean, I know you said it's for yourself. You wanted to go on that journey to learn for yourself, but besides you, who is this book for?
Aubrey: You know, Michele, I think the book is for anyone in transition. I certainly use my lens as a Gen X woman in her 50s and thinking, looking ahead to the empty nest years, my baby is 15 starting 10th grade, and I've two sons who are launching, but I really now believe that the tools and strategies that I include in the book, a bunch of validated evidence-based tools. So, surveys and worksheets and all kinds of exercises where you can start to get a sense of like, oh, who am I now and what should come next? All of these tools are gender neutral and generation neutral, meaning anyone in transition, I think, could benefit — anybody asking that question, what's next?
Skalicky: And I have to say, I already did one of the surveys yesterday and it was very enlightening. So, I appreciate that you include those very tangible ways that people can find out who they are and what their strengths are. So, what were the kinds of stories that you wanted to include? What were you looking for when you were talking to women and having them tell you their stories?
Aubrey: Well, I was looking for women who I think had sort of burst through what I call the midlife passage or the third turn of life. And let me explain that. So, you know, I think for much of our life, we're handed this societal script of sort of learn, earn and then retire. And I was not comfortable with that societal script because when I look ahead, people 10, 20, 30 years older than me, my mother included, who's in her 80s, who's still very vibrant and active, I did not like the word retired, not because I don't like the concept, but because the word tired is inside of it. And the people I know who have found joy and adventure in this third turn of life are not tired at all. So, I was looking for some way to replace that script. So, what actually should take the place of this retirement mindset? And what I found out in the world is that the women who were living with purpose and adventure and joy, they had embraced what I now call learn, earn, return. And what I mean by return is a return to the kind of playful child within. Right? There's time and space now to think about. you know, what lit me up as a child? Or what hobby did I always wanted to pursue, but I did not? And this is people living by heart and intuition, not living by the societal script. These are people who are sort of pushing back against the accolades phase of life, where everything is about building your career and more looking at the legacy part of life, of sort of asking, you know, what can I do to make a difference? How can I parlay my strengths and talents into something new that's adventurous and purposeful and fun for me but also might help solve a problem or be good for the world?
Skalicky: And you really, through the book, empower women, it seems like, to really take a hard look at themselves and what it is that they love, what it is that their strengths are, and what they might do next. It gives you hope that there's something beyond, you know, the world of work and raising kids. At least that's what I got.
Aubrey: Absolutely. That's exactly. Well, I'm glad that that was the message you got, because that is exactly my intention.
Skalicky: Yeah. I even wrote down that learn, earn, retire that you changed to learn earn return. Because I just, I love that phrase. And as someone who's seen both daughters leave the nest, both my girls have gone through college and have learned to fly, and they're on their own, it's a huge change. I know there's a lot of emotion involved with that. It seems like it gets easier, but it's never, you know, there's always that rollercoaster that you're on because you're always a mom.
Aubrey: Oh, yes. Yeah.
Skalicky: So, what do you hope your book offers that kind of sums it up for women facing not only these significant life changes but just getting older?
Aubrey: Yes. Well, you know, you point to a really — you make a really excellent point that our job as a parent is never done. And so, you know, I could have called this book like the Sandwich Generation, and I don't think it would have appealed to anybody because I wouldn't have been telling anybody anything they don't already know. We are well aware of our obligations as women, and we are well aware that we will always be caregivers. Many of us are caregiving on both sides, parents and children, and I don't think that ever ends, nor should we expect it. And many of us will be working for many, many more years. Women retire with 30% less than men. And so, women, many women have to keep working. What I want to carve out, and what I hope I give people, is that you don't have to be a billionaire or a super influencer to find your third turn. If you have an hour this week, use that hour to ask yourself, what could I be doing for fun? What is it that lit me up as a child that I could return to? Or what is it I could do to feed my soul? This is not an all or nothing pivot. This is a very slow cross-fade from these busy years of parenting and working to a life that hopefully offers a little bit more time for you to explore yourself and to give back.
Skalicky: I love that, and I do think it is a process because what you loved before you started raising kids and getting busy with your job may have shifted, so you may feel lost. And I love that this book offers those tools. Well, thank you so much, Allison, for talking to me. I'd love to talk to you a lot more, but it looks like we're running out of time. There is one more quick question if we do have time. What did this book or. There is one more question. If we do have time, how did this book help you find your path?
Aubrey: How did the book help me find my path?
Skalicky: Yeah, into the next stage.
Aubrey: Into the next stage. So, I think that for me, a big aha moment for me is that even if I stop being a reporter and morph my career into something else, I am taking all of the skills that I have been working at for 25 years and using them in a new way. For 25 years, I've been distilling science into actionable information that people can understand. The missing ingredient of that was an opportunity for me to share wisdom. I think women of our age have a lot of wisdom to share. And so, my new hope is that I can combine sort of my evidence-based reporting with wisdom to inspire.
Skalicky: Well, thank you for your book and thank you for all you do, all the reporting on NPR. And thanks for talking to me.
Aubrey: Thank you so much, Michele. It's been wonderful.
